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Post by Hero on Mar 30, 2021 20:05:27 GMT
It wasn’t perfect but instead of optimizing we threw out the baby with the bath water. I think eight is the right number for a playoff. The biggest problem with the BCS was, it was just TWO teams. If they used a full computer system, like SAGARIN even, and picked 8? You'd be SURE to have the most deserving teams included. They could actually do that, and avoid anti-trust issues. Maybe, that's the way out here? I only looked at it as the best rating we ever used...IMHO I vote for Sagarin and eight.
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Post by ajbuckeye on Mar 31, 2021 13:31:29 GMT
The biggest problem with the BCS was, it was just TWO teams. If they used a full computer system, like SAGARIN even, and picked 8? You'd be SURE to have the most deserving teams included. They could actually do that, and avoid anti-trust issues. Maybe, that's the way out here? I only looked at it as the best rating we ever used...IMHO I vote for Sagarin and eight. I would be good with eight and any computer ranking system that they would agree with. I would probably prefer the have 10 systems used and take the average. Looking at the BCS, they tried to get it right but they still could not get away with the human element dominating the process. That being said, I like that far better then listening to the eye test junkies.
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Post by bluehen on Apr 1, 2021 17:48:54 GMT
Don't need any computers or voters...we have standings from 10 leagues including their champions. Think outside of the opinionated and mythical box.
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Post by Hero on Apr 2, 2021 0:04:51 GMT
Don't need any computers or voters...we have standings from 10 leagues including their champions. Think outside of the opinionated and mythical box. Not gonna happen.
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Post by ajbuckeye on Apr 2, 2021 14:45:33 GMT
Don't need any computers or voters...we have standings from 10 leagues including their champions. Think outside of the opinionated and mythical box. This way way outside of the box for me. There are no professional or collegiate sports that I am aware of that only take conference champs or division winners only into the post season.
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Post by Bevo on Apr 2, 2021 15:12:26 GMT
Don't need any computers or voters...we have standings from 10 leagues including their champions. Think outside of the opinionated and mythical box. This way way outside of the box for me. There are no professional or collegiate sports that I am aware of that only take conference champs or division winners only into the post season. There are no other professional or collegiate sports that are made up of such widely disparate groups of divisions. It’s a Gordian Knot, trying to pull all the P5 and G5 conferences together into a playoff.... given the starting point of strong, regionally focused conferences.
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Post by tigercpa on Apr 2, 2021 17:35:48 GMT
This way way outside of the box for me. There are no professional or collegiate sports that I am aware of that only take conference champs or division winners only into the post season. There are no other professional or collegiate sports that are made up of such widely disparate groups of divisions. It’s a Gordian Knot, trying to pull all the P5 and G5 conferences together into a playoff.... given the starting point of strong, regionally focused conferences. and the lack of parity between P5 and G5. Once you acknowledge the gap there, you realize an all-inclusive P5/G5 tourney is a non-starter.
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Post by stumpystew on Apr 3, 2021 13:31:14 GMT
Tigercpa, while it may be a non-starter now, it will change. The G5 would have a legitimate shot at the title. It will start with a few upset G5 wins, then advancing in the tournament and then evening being in the title game. And where do I get this ides, from the basketball and baseball tournaments that have this format. This year, half of the final four are non P5 schools. And Coastal Carolina won the baseball. Why, cause they had access.
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Post by bluehen on Apr 3, 2021 14:00:44 GMT
Don't need any computers or voters...we have standings from 10 leagues including their champions. Think outside of the opinionated and mythical box. Not gonna happen.
Of course it won't happen ,Hero, because major college football is the only sport on Earth at any level in which the championship of that sport is NOT administered by the governing body of the sport. There is the problem, plain and simple, and why we'll probably never have a fair and inclusive championship.
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Post by bluehen on Apr 3, 2021 14:05:17 GMT
Don't need any computers or voters...we have standings from 10 leagues including their champions. Think outside of the opinionated and mythical box. This way way outside of the box for me. There are no professional or collegiate sports that I am aware of that only take conference champs or division winners only into the post season. AJ, name any sport (except exhibition FBS football) whereby regular season champions are not permitted to advance to championship post season play. Adding 'at large' entries is commonplace in intercollegiate sports and good, imo, but champions get 'autos' in every other sport on Earth.
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Post by bluehen on Apr 3, 2021 14:09:27 GMT
Tigercpa, while it may be a non-starter now, it will change. The G5 would have a legitimate shot at the title. It will start with a few upset G5 wins, then advancing in the tournament and then evening being in the title game. And where do I get this ides, from the basketball and baseball tournaments that have this format. This year, half of the final four are non P5 schools. And Coastal Carolina won the baseball. Why, cause they had access. Yes "access" is the American way. Can't get why some of these guys want to reject that concept for major CF.
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Post by tigercpa on Apr 5, 2021 1:07:51 GMT
Tigercpa, while it may be a non-starter now, it will change. The G5 would have a legitimate shot at the title. It will start with a few upset G5 wins, then advancing in the tournament and then evening being in the title game. And where do I get this ides, from the basketball and baseball tournaments that have this format. This year, half of the final four are non P5 schools. And Coastal Carolina won the baseball. Why, cause they had access. It's changing, but getting worse. G5 (WITH WAC) vs. P5 (WITH BIG EAST) RECORD WIN PCT ALL-TIME 686-2450-20 0.217 LAST 20 YR 417-1788 0.189 LAST 10 YR 210-944 0.182 LAST 5 YR 98-487 0.168 The data says otherwise. Historically, G5 has won 22% of games against P5. Over the last 5 years, that win % has dropped nearly 25% (5/22).
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Post by bluehen on Apr 5, 2021 1:51:21 GMT
Here's a little scenario demonstrating how the exclusiveness and unfairness in FBS football works against a more competitive climate :
There is an intelligent stud defensive HS kid in the Houston, Texas area who is recruited by all the big win-at-all-cost TV brand names of the 'so called' P5 ( a non NCAA designated division). The kid grew up as a Rice Owl fan and his parents were Rice grads. He loves the University the Engineering majors offered, the campus and the football coaching staff and Rice FB would certainly love to have him. However, he has to explain to the coach..."I'm sorry coach. I love your program but you're not P5 and CUSA teams are not permitted to compete for national championships so I guess I'll be signing with a program that is permitted to do that " If these non , so called, P5 programs had fair opportunities and access this kid likely signs with Rice and the Rice's of FBS college football gradually get stronger. Fair and open opportunity access is a very good thing for college sports and that's why I often reference NCAA sports championships---they are fair and open to all. The CFP/ESPN/Dr.Pepper football 'Invitational' is NOT. It's bullshit.
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Post by Bevo on Apr 5, 2021 2:20:02 GMT
Here's a little scenario demonstrating how the exclusiveness and unfairness in FBS football works against a more competitive climate : There is an intelligent stud defensive HS kid in the Houston, Texas area who is recruited by all the big win-at-all-cost TV brand names of the 'so called' P5 ( a non NCAA designated division). The kid grew up as a Rice Owl fan and his parents were Rice grads. He loves the University the Engineering majors offered, the campus and the football coaching staff and Rice FB would certainly love to have him. However, he has to explain to the coach..."I'm sorry coach. I love your program but you're not P5 and CUSA teams are not permitted to compete for national championships so I guess I'll be signing with a program that is permitted to do that " If these non , so called, P5 programs had fair opportunities and access this kid likely signs with Rice and the Rice's of FBS college football gradually get stronger. Fair and open opportunity access is a very good thing for college sports and that's why I often reference NCAA sports championships---they are fair and open to all. The CFP/ESPN/Dr.Pepper football 'Invitational' is NOT. It's bullshit. Who is this kid?
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Post by tigercpa on Apr 5, 2021 13:42:39 GMT
Here's a little scenario demonstrating how the exclusiveness and unfairness in FBS football works against a more competitive climate : There is an intelligent stud defensive HS kid in the Houston, Texas area who is recruited by all the big win-at-all-cost TV brand names of the 'so called' P5 ( a non NCAA designated division). The kid grew up as a Rice Owl fan and his parents were Rice grads. He loves the University the Engineering majors offered, the campus and the football coaching staff and Rice FB would certainly love to have him. However, he has to explain to the coach..."I'm sorry coach. I love your program but you're not P5 and CUSA teams are not permitted to compete for national championships so I guess I'll be signing with a program that is permitted to do that " If these non , so called, P5 programs had fair opportunities and access this kid likely signs with Rice and the Rice's of FBS college football gradually get stronger. Fair and open opportunity access is a very good thing for college sports and that's why I often reference NCAA sports championships---they are fair and open to all. The CFP/ESPN/Dr.Pepper football 'Invitational' is NOT. It's bullshit. I think both the G5 and P5 monikers are too all-inclusive. Schools in both groups benefit from the achievements of the top tier schools. Neither the G5 nor P5 are monoliths....there's a wide range of talent and accomplishment in both. Every team is permitted to compete for the playoff and championship. The recipe is well known: (1) win your conference, (2) go 13-0 / 12-1, and (3) have a top strength of schedule. That's it. Bevo has stated this before as well. To me, #3 is the biggest hurdle right now for the G5. The perception (and "perception is reality") that the G5 isn't battle-tested in terms of opponents. Currently, it's the biggest thing that is the deciding factor, IMO.
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