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GOAG??
Feb 4, 2022 18:30:07 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 4, 2022 18:30:07 GMT
Right ....fans. Casual sports fans vote on emotions , not knowledge If I was a batter vs Nolan I'd prefer to wear a football helmet with full face guard ....and any other body armor available
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GOAG??
Feb 4, 2022 18:30:57 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 4, 2022 18:30:57 GMT
How would you like to combine Ryan 'stuff' with Maddox control ?
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GOAG??
Feb 4, 2022 18:47:20 GMT
Post by tigercpa on Feb 4, 2022 18:47:20 GMT
Like you said, when Nolan was at his very greatest he was unhitable but the other side of Nolan's coin tells a story too....the total picture. You obviously weren't aware of his control problems....similar is the Saban legend or Bear legend and hype. How many casual sports fans know that 40 other CF head coaches were more difficult to beat than the popular 'GOAT" ? ...Same thing with lots of hyped names....Brett Favre for example. How many casual FB fans realize that Brett ( the famous hyped 'gunslinger') is the career NFL leader in interceptions thrown and also sacked the most ? You, sometimes have to dig through the hype to get the big picture. I'm here for you, Bevo, to help you on that Back to Nolan : I did go back and checked Posnanski's list and Nolan was his 50th greatest player of all time ( higher than I remembered). That's quite a superlative ! This GOAT stuff is fun.
Nolan's story is one of those great "What Ifs" in sports... ...What if Nolan Ryan had control ? ....What If Josh Gibson, Satchel Paige, Oscar Charleston etc. were allowed to play MLB in their primes ? ...what if Mickey Mantle was injury free ?
....what if Babe Ruth worked out and had nutrition and weight training ? and a whippy 26 oz bat ? .or even more frightening- took PEDs ?
...what if Knute Rockne (the true goat at the top level) had not died in a plane crash after only 11 seasons ? ....what if Walter Johnson had a good breaking ball ?
Ruth did have weight training...he continually trained his weight to go up!
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GOAG??
Feb 4, 2022 19:44:43 GMT
Post by Bevo on Feb 4, 2022 19:44:43 GMT
Right ....fans. Casual sports fans vote on emotions , not knowledge yea... Two MILLION of them. In the same year, Ryan also had the 5th highest % of HOF voters, on his 1st ballot. 5. Nolan Ryan, 1999 Vote total: 98.8% (491/497) Were those guys all voting on emotion too? Nolan is LEGENDARY!
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GOAG??
Feb 4, 2022 20:02:23 GMT
Post by Bevo on Feb 4, 2022 20:02:23 GMT
Ryan are you serious ? He was the strikeout king and had an overpowering fastball for sure( and a killer good late breaking curve ), but Bevo did you ever wonder why Nolan's career WP (.525) wasn't all that much higher than .500 ?......Wildness !. He had the worst control in major league pitching history and gave up tons of unearned runs and no pitcher will ever touch his career record for walks. (2,795). Nobody else had more than 1800. It's one of those untouchable records. If Nolan had decent control he could have been a Walter Johnson type and maybe a top 5 guy., but Nolan only finished 32 games above .500 in a 27 year career because of that horrendous control problem.. Posnanski ranked him but closer to 100 best than near the top.I remember his blurb about Nolan....".the best pitcher ever and the worst pitcher ever" Ryan took a Bo Jackson hit to the mouth, still managed to get Bo out, and struck out 17 batters over 8 innings with blood pouring out of his mouth. So there’s that. LOL And, he put Robin Ventura in a headlock while punching him! Nolan was the LAST of the "old school", TOUGH pitchers. Like Drysdale... who gave one of my favorite quotes of all time.. "Why intentionally walk a batter with 4 pitches, when I can just HIT him with 1?" That's ALMOST as good as Tug McGraw's quote about how he would spend his new $1M salary.
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GOAG??
Feb 4, 2022 21:16:30 GMT
Post by tigercpa on Feb 4, 2022 21:16:30 GMT
Ryan took a Bo Jackson hit to the mouth, still managed to get Bo out, and struck out 17 batters over 8 innings with blood pouring out of his mouth. So there’s that. LOL And, he put Robin Ventura in a headlock while punching him! Nolan was the LAST of the "old school", TOUGH pitchers. Like Drysdale... who gave one of my favorite quotes of all time.. "Why intentionally walk a batter with 4 pitches, when I can just HIT him with 1?" That's ALMOST as good as Tug McGraw's quote about how he would spend his new $1M salary. Ryan would have been an 80s NBA player if he played round ball.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 9:54:28 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 5, 2022 9:54:28 GMT
This must be the official fan club of the wildest, lack of control pitcher to ever take the mound who averaged .8 of a win per season over .500 for his entire MLB career despite all the strikeouts and no-hitters. In that sense he was incomparable.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 10:22:21 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 5, 2022 10:22:21 GMT
Like you said, when Nolan was at his very greatest he was unhitable but the other side of Nolan's coin tells a story too....the total picture. You obviously weren't aware of his control problems....similar is the Saban legend or Bear legend and hype. How many casual sports fans know that 40 other CF head coaches were more difficult to beat than the popular 'GOAT" ? ...Same thing with lots of hyped names....Brett Favre for example. How many casual FB fans realize that Brett ( the famous hyped 'gunslinger') is the career NFL leader in interceptions thrown and also sacked the most ? You, sometimes have to dig through the hype to get the big picture. I'm here for you, Bevo, to help you on that Back to Nolan : I did go back and checked Posnanski's list and Nolan was his 50th greatest player of all time ( higher than I remembered). That's quite a superlative ! This GOAT stuff is fun.
Nolan's story is one of those great "What Ifs" in sports... ...What if Nolan Ryan had control ? ....What If Josh Gibson, Satchel Paige, Oscar Charleston etc. were allowed to play MLB in their primes ? ...what if Mickey Mantle was injury free ?
....what if Babe Ruth worked out and had nutrition and weight training ? and a whippy 26 oz bat ? .or even more frightening- took PEDs ?
...what if Knute Rockne (the true goat at the top level) had not died in a plane crash after only 11 seasons ? ....what if Walter Johnson had a good breaking ball ?
Ruth did have weight training...he continually trained his weight to go up! Yeah, he was powered by PDDs......performance de -hancing drugs ( hot dogs, beer, women ) Ruth , imo, is still the all time freak of nature in sports.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 10:48:55 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 5, 2022 10:48:55 GMT
With all this Baseball chatting how about everybody's personal all time team including 4 RHPs and 4 LHPs ?......not necessarily our perceptions of greatest but our personal favorites ( who still must be great )
The Hen dream team """"""""""""""""""""
Catcher - Josh Gibson First Base - Stan Musial Second Base - Rogers Hornsby Shortstop - Honus Wagner Third Base - Mike Schmidt left Field - Ted Williams ( platoon with Hank Aaron) Center Field - Willie Mays Right Field - Babe Ruth LHPs - Steve Carlton, Lefty Grove, Sandy Koufax, Warren Spahn RHPs - Satchel Paige, Christy Mathewson, Walter Johnson, Bob Gibson
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 12:08:19 GMT
via mobile
Post by doc on Feb 5, 2022 12:08:19 GMT
With all this Baseball chatting how about everybody's personal all time team including 4 RHPs and 4 LHPs ?......not necessarily our perceptions of greatest but our personal favorites ( who still must be great ) The Hen dream team """""""""""""""""""" Catcher - Josh Gibson First Base - Stan Musial Second Base - Rogers Hornsby Shortstop - Honus Wagner Third Base - Mike Schmidt left Field - Ted Williams ( platoon with Hank Aaron) Center Field - Willie Mays Right Field - Babe Ruth LHPs - Steve Carlton, Lefty Grove, Sandy Koufax, Warren Spahn RHPs - Satchel Paige, Christy Mathewson, Walter Johnson, Bob Gibson I’d start with Bench, Gehrig and Morgan. 3B is Mike Schmidt. OF is Bonds, Mays and Aaron. SS would be ARoid. Ruth is the DH. Bob Gibson, Sandy Koufax, Tom Seaver, Randy Johnson and Bob Feller. Closers Dennis Eckersly and Mariano Rivera. Bond s and ARod should be in the HOF in my opinion. Same with Pete Rose - douche bag as a person but a HOF ball player.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 12:09:19 GMT
via mobile
Post by doc on Feb 5, 2022 12:09:19 GMT
My favorite athlete of all time is Muhammad Ali and he would be my GOAT as well.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 12:21:12 GMT
Post by Hero on Feb 5, 2022 12:21:12 GMT
Also, Bevo , do you realize that Nolan's career 3.19 ERA is not even in the top 150 all time ? ERA can be a stupid number when playing with clueless idiots.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 16:33:52 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 5, 2022 16:33:52 GMT
Huh ?
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 16:45:04 GMT
Post by bluehen on Feb 5, 2022 16:45:04 GMT
With all this Baseball chatting how about everybody's personal all time team including 4 RHPs and 4 LHPs ?......not necessarily our perceptions of greatest but our personal favorites ( who still must be great ) The Hen dream team """""""""""""""""""" Catcher - Josh Gibson First Base - Stan Musial Second Base - Rogers Hornsby Shortstop - Honus Wagner Third Base - Mike Schmidt left Field - Ted Williams ( platoon with Hank Aaron) Center Field - Willie Mays Right Field - Babe Ruth LHPs - Steve Carlton, Lefty Grove, Sandy Koufax, Warren Spahn RHPs - Satchel Paige, Christy Mathewson, Walter Johnson, Bob Gibson I’d start with Bench, Gehrig and Morgan. 3B is Mike Schmidt. OF is Bonds, Mays and Aaron. SS would be ARoid. Ruth is the DH. Bob Gibson, Sandy Koufax, Tom Seaver, Randy Johnson and Bob Feller. Closers Dennis Eckersly and Mariano Rivera. Bond s and ARod should be in the HOF in my opinion. Same with Pete Rose - douche bag as a person but a HOF ball player.
Good one, doc. I stayed away from the juicers and creeps.....Rose,Cobb,Clemens, Bonds etc.
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GOAG??
Feb 5, 2022 17:10:10 GMT
Post by tigercpa on Feb 5, 2022 17:10:10 GMT
My favorite athlete of all time is Muhammad Ali and he would be my GOAT as well. As far as athletes go, any such list would arguably have to include Deion and Bo.
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