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Post by Bevo on Aug 29, 2017 20:03:09 GMT
OMG!! I was driving to Frankfort today, and was listening to FoxNews. They sent a reporter to Columbia Lakes to check out the "levee breech". Instead of finding a bunch of fleeing people, they found a bunch of locals with backhoes, bags of sand and bricks... with poles, planks and guts. They had "repaired the breech". The reporter ask if this make-shift repair would hold. His answer?
"Yessir. We've made it strong. We got 500 homes in this neighborhood. There not going to flood. Not on my watch!"
LOLOL. Them is MY people!
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Post by tigercpa on Aug 29, 2017 20:41:00 GMT
Yes, he can and should propose building new refineries, but I can't imagine a better time than the present. I say again, you have no freaking clue what you're talking about. We don't need any new refineries. They are exporting half of what they make now. Although we haven't built any "new" refineries since 1977, we have increased overall capacity tremendously. More than 50% just since 1985. A quirk in the stupid EPA regulations allows refiners to "grandfather in" many existing emission rules if they "expand". So, they avoid most of the costliest new rules that would apply to a "new" refinery. If you want a NEW refinery? Just change the EPA regs. But, even if you did, no one would build one right now. We don't need the capacity. And, now is a TERRIBLE time to try to build one. Since the shale oil boom began a few years ago, petrochemical plant construction has EXPLODED (no pun intended). Construction costs have also gotten completely out of hand. MANY projects are going 50-100% OVER budget and 1-2 years delayed in startup. It's just crazy right now. And, this hurricane won't help. The LAST THING we need is the freaking government getting in the game and subsidizing a bunch of new refineries. Just change the rules, the market will take care of it. As for knowing the difference between personal loss vs property loss. I know enough to know that it's in very poor taste to be discussing that aspect of this tragedy NOW, while we're still in the middle of it. The personal loss is now up again... 14 dead the last I heard. I fear that number will be much higher before we're finished. And, we are definitely NOT finished with this story yet. I am quite confident that Harvey will be a NET LOSS to this country. Economically and personally. MOST of these people who are being flooded have NO flood insurance. They're going to be devastated. 15 now...a police officer drowned in high water heading to help rescue some people
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Post by FLORIDA HERD FAN on Aug 29, 2017 21:03:38 GMT
Yes, he can and should propose building new refineries, but I can't imagine a better time than the present. I say again, you have no freaking clue what you're talking about. We don't need any new refineries. They are exporting half of what they make now. Although we haven't built any "new" refineries since 1977, we have increased overall capacity tremendously. More than 50% just since 1985. A quirk in the stupid EPA regulations allows refiners to "grandfather in" many existing emission rules if they "expand". So, they avoid most of the costliest new rules that would apply to a "new" refinery. If you want a NEW refinery? Just change the EPA regs. But, even if you did, no one would build one right now. We don't need the capacity. And, now is a TERRIBLE time to try to build one. Since the shale oil boom began a few years ago, petrochemical plant construction has EXPLODED (no pun intended). Construction costs have also gotten completely out of hand. MANY projects are going 50-100% OVER budget and 1-2 years delayed in startup. It's just crazy right now. And, this hurricane won't help. The LAST THING we need is the freaking government getting in the game and subsidizing a bunch of new refineries. Just change the rules, the market will take care of it. As for knowing the difference between personal loss vs property loss. I know enough to know that it's in very poor taste to be discussing that aspect of this tragedy NOW, while we're still in the middle of it. The personal loss is now up again... 14 dead the last I heard. I fear that number will be much higher before we're finished. And, we are definitely NOT finished with this story yet. I am quite confident that Harvey will be a NET LOSS to this country. Economically and personally. MOST of these people who are being flooded have NO flood insurance. They're going to be devastated. Bunk. The current updated 16.5% shortfall in refining production is prima fascie evidence that there is a lack of reserve refining capability. Any event, from natural disasters, fires, explosions, sabotage, acts of terrorism to major improvements would result in shortages and higher prices. Market forces have been screaming for decades for increasing refining capabilities, evidenced by the numerous applications for permits. In every instance, courts, the EPA and other government regulators cooperated with or have bowed to the pressure from environmentalists, and have made it impossible for applicants to secure authorization to proceed. Not once have I advocated government funding for new refineries! I don't understand why you continue to make stuff up. All I am suggesting is that Trump spearhead reforms in the application and approval process for building new refineries. Streamline the environmental impact approval process, and eliminate regulations that are specifically designed to make approvals impossible. It doesn't require money, but it does require leadership. If Trump isn't capable of leading, I recommend that he turn it over to someone who can. Like Hero. |
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Post by Bevo on Aug 29, 2017 22:19:35 GMT
I say again, you have no freaking clue what you're talking about. We don't need any new refineries. They are exporting half of what they make now. Although we haven't built any "new" refineries since 1977, we have increased overall capacity tremendously. More than 50% just since 1985. A quirk in the stupid EPA regulations allows refiners to "grandfather in" many existing emission rules if they "expand". So, they avoid most of the costliest new rules that would apply to a "new" refinery. If you want a NEW refinery? Just change the EPA regs. But, even if you did, no one would build one right now. We don't need the capacity. And, now is a TERRIBLE time to try to build one. Since the shale oil boom began a few years ago, petrochemical plant construction has EXPLODED (no pun intended). Construction costs have also gotten completely out of hand. MANY projects are going 50-100% OVER budget and 1-2 years delayed in startup. It's just crazy right now. And, this hurricane won't help. The LAST THING we need is the freaking government getting in the game and subsidizing a bunch of new refineries. Just change the rules, the market will take care of it. As for knowing the difference between personal loss vs property loss. I know enough to know that it's in very poor taste to be discussing that aspect of this tragedy NOW, while we're still in the middle of it. The personal loss is now up again... 14 dead the last I heard. I fear that number will be much higher before we're finished. And, we are definitely NOT finished with this story yet. I am quite confident that Harvey will be a NET LOSS to this country. Economically and personally. MOST of these people who are being flooded have NO flood insurance. They're going to be devastated. Bunk. The current updated 16.5% shortfall in refining production is prima fascie evidence that there is a lack of reserve refining capability. Any event, from natural disasters, fires, explosions, sabotage, acts of terrorism to major improvements would result in shortages and higher prices. Market forces have been screaming for decades for increasing refining capabilities, evidenced by the numerous applications for permits. In every instance, courts, the EPA and other government regulators cooperated with or have bowed to the pressure from environmentalists, and have made it impossible for applicants to secure authorization to proceed. Not once have I advocated government funding for new refineries! I don't understand why you continue to make stuff up. All I am suggesting is that Trump spearhead reforms in the application and approval process for building new refineries. Streamline the environmental impact approval process, and eliminate regulations that are specifically designed to make approvals impossible. It doesn't require money, but it does require leadership. If Trump isn't capable of leading, I recommend that he turn it over to someone who can. Like Hero. You don't know what the hell you're talking about. I do. This is my profession. But, congratulations, Troll, for drawing me back into a discussion. I tried to avoid it, because.. I have taken notice that this is ALL you do: Post stupid crap, designed to dig at people, to lure them into useless discussions. I avoided it for a month. I'll try even harder to make sure it doesn't happen again. |
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Post by tigercpa on Aug 29, 2017 22:25:42 GMT
Caroline Baum at MarketWatch says "no, hurricanes are NOT good for the economy" - it's the broken window fallacy.".
If natural disasters are such a good deal for the economy, why wait for Acts of God to come along? Why not bomb our own cities so that we can rebuild and reap the benefits?
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Post by Bevo on Aug 29, 2017 22:33:14 GMT
Caroline Baum at MarketWatch says "no, hurricanes are NOT good for the economy" - it's the broken window fallacy.". If natural disasters are such a good deal for the economy, why wait for Acts of God to come along? Why not bomb our own cities so that we can rebuild and reap the benefits? They're "good" for Home Depot and Lowes... not too many other people. |
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Post by FLORIDA HERD FAN on Aug 30, 2017 2:18:36 GMT
Bunk. The current updated 16.5% shortfall in refining production is prima fascie evidence that there is a lack of reserve refining capability. Any event, from natural disasters, fires, explosions, sabotage, acts of terrorism to major improvements would result in shortages and higher prices. Market forces have been screaming for decades for increasing refining capabilities, evidenced by the numerous applications for permits. In every instance, courts, the EPA and other government regulators cooperated with or have bowed to the pressure from environmentalists, and have made it impossible for applicants to secure authorization to proceed. Not once have I advocated government funding for new refineries! I don't understand why you continue to make stuff up. All I am suggesting is that Trump spearhead reforms in the application and approval process for building new refineries. Streamline the environmental impact approval process, and eliminate regulations that are specifically designed to make approvals impossible. It doesn't require money, but it does require leadership. If Trump isn't capable of leading, I recommend that he turn it over to someone who can. Like Hero. You don't know what the hell you're talking about. I do. This is my profession. But, congratulations, Troll, for drawing me back into a discussion. I tried to avoid it, because.. I have taken notice that this is ALL you do: Post stupid crap, designed to dig at people, to lure them into useless discussions. I avoided it for a month. I'll try even harder to make sure it doesn't happen again. I see that you are once again resigned to childish name calling. That is hardly a surprise. Bevo's way is to maintain the status quo, where environmental wackos and leftist government bureaucrats block the free market at every turn, making it impossible over the past 40 years for an application to construct a new refinery to have any chance of being approved. FHF's way is to streamline the process, to give new refinery applications a fair hearing so that the free market will have at least a fighting chance to succeed. So, your occupation is enabling environmental activists and blocking the free market? Three lashes with a wet noodle -- I should have guessed. |
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Post by Hero on Aug 30, 2017 12:12:32 GMT
You don't know what the hell you're talking about. I do. This is my profession. But, congratulations, Troll, for drawing me back into a discussion. I tried to avoid it, because.. I have taken notice that this is ALL you do: Post stupid crap, designed to dig at people, to lure them into useless discussions. I avoided it for a month. I'll try even harder to make sure it doesn't happen again. I see that you are once again resigned to childish name calling. That is hardly a surprise. Bevo's way is to maintain the status quo, where environmental wackos and leftist government bureaucrats block the free market at every turn, making it impossible over the past 40 years for an application to construct a new refinery to have any chance of being approved. FHF's way is to streamline the process, to give new refinery applications a fair hearing so that the free market will have at least a fighting chance to succeed. So, your occupation is enabling environmental activists and blocking the free market? Three lashes with a wet noodle -- I should have guessed. Try to refrain from calling names like childish.  |
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Post by FLORIDA HERD FAN on Aug 30, 2017 13:35:01 GMT
3 more lashes with a wet noodle. That brings the total to 6. The pain. Oh, woe is me.
If you look back, you will see that the economic benefits I listed from hurricanes and tropical storms were primarily other than reconstruction.
The most important financial benefit, practically incalculable, of hurricanes and tropical storms is that they make the zone on both sides of the equator around the world habitable. Also, of far greater impact than reconstruction is bringing rains to drought stricken regions, filling reservoirs and revitalizing agriculture.
Yes, there is an economic benefit to reconstruction that sometimes is greater than the economic loss, and sometimes less. While hurricanes and tropical storms are indiscriminate, humans actually do intentionally destroy entire areas purposely, without bombs, in order to make way for new construction. Roads and bridges are routinely destroyed and replaced. Entire downtown areas have been destroyed and rebuilt in the name of "urban renewal". Blighted neighborhoods are bulldozed to the ground and rebuilt. This process of renewal is intentional and targeted.
To simply point out this truth does in no way mitigate or desensitize the human suffering that occasions natural disasters.
That said, it is evident that Bevo has gone over the edge. Better put, I have driven Bevo over the edge.
The debates in which we have been engaged have zero influence beyond this forum. In our imaginations, we might have delusions that others beyond our insignificant circle pay some heed to our words of great wisdom. So, we debate with vigor. But it seems that no one, other than Bevo, takes it personally.
Don't get me wrong. Bevo is a good guy, for whom I have considerable affection and great respect. He is highly accomplished, and is obviously a devoted husband and father. But, I have succeeded in making a small part of his life intolerable. Not purposely, of course.
So, I will grant Bevo a reprieve from the misery I have caused, and will take my leave from this forum. I consider one and all here to be friends, including Bevo, and wish everyone continued success and joy, and that the football program that each of us supports exceeds all expectations.
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Post by Hero on Aug 30, 2017 13:46:46 GMT
3 more lashes with a wet noodle. That brings the total to 6. The pain. Oh, woe is me. If you look back, you will see that the economic benefits I listed from hurricanes and tropical storms were primarily other than reconstruction. The most important financial benefit, practically incalculable, of hurricanes and tropical storms is that they make the zone on both sides of the equator around the world habitable. Also, of far greater impact than reconstruction is bringing rains to drought stricken regions, filling reservoirs and revitalizing agriculture. Yes, there is an economic benefit to reconstruction that sometimes is greater than the economic loss, and sometimes less. While hurricanes and tropical storms are indiscriminate, humans actually do intentionally destroy entire areas purposely, without bombs, in order to make way for new construction. Roads and bridges are routinely destroyed and replaced. Entire downtown areas have been destroyed and rebuilt in the name of "urban renewal". Blighted neighborhoods are bulldozed to the ground and rebuilt. This process of renewal is intentional and targeted. To simply point out this truth does in no way mitigate or desensitize the human suffering that occasions natural disasters. That said, it is evident that Bevo has gone over the edge. Better put, I have driven Bevo over the edge. The debates in which we have been engaged have zero influence beyond this forum. In our imaginations, we might have delusions that others beyond our insignificant circle pay some heed to our words of great wisdom. So, we debate with vigor. But it seems that no one, other than Bevo, takes it personally. Don't get me wrong. Bevo is a good guy, for whom I have considerable affection and great respect. He is highly accomplished, and is obviously a devoted husband and father. But, I have succeeded in making a small part of his life intolerable. Not purposely, of course. So, I will grant Bevo a reprieve from the misery I have caused, and will take my leave from this forum. I consider one and all here to be friends, including Bevo, and wish everyone continued success and joy, and that the football program that each of us supports exceeds all expectations. You haven't driven Bevo to anything. You have dished out plenty and taken plenty. Don't get thin skinned now. What am I supposed to do, go back to arguing with my wife? Don't leave you big knuckle head. This is just a big game of verbal ping pong which we all enjoy...including you. |
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Post by Bevo on Aug 30, 2017 14:48:08 GMT
3 more lashes with a wet noodle. That brings the total to 6. I'll settle for 60 and we'll call it even. :-) it is evident that Bevo has gone over the edge. Better put, I have driven Bevo over the edge. ?? If I've gone over any edge, it's because my sense of humor is diminished when my home town is under-water. I also have no time or interest in debating with someone who, after I have explained that refining capacity HAS grown, and CAN grow as needed.... simply replies, "Bunk". It's a pointless, useless, worthless discussion. It's apparent to me: on this issue, you don't know what you're talking about, and... you don't really WANT to know. You just want to agitate. I prefer to engage in discussions where I MIGHT learn something, or be able to teach someone... even if, that rarely happens. Well, to the extent that this is a problem, I CAN FIX IT, for myself. Rather easily, by deciding what to reply to, and what to ignore. I'm not very good at this process, yet. But, I am getting better. No need to deprive everyone else of their own right to choose for themselves. Bevo is a good guy, for whom I have considerable affection and great respect. He is highly accomplished, and is obviously a devoted husband and father. More, more, more!!! Flattery will get you everywhere! You are also a great guy, at heart. I always try to keep that in mind. I will grant Bevo a reprieve from the misery I have caused, and will take my leave from this forum. Oh puh-lease. If you want to leave the board, do it. But, don't lay it on me. You sound like Nebraska. Football season has FINALLY arrived. ALL IS GOOD. Looks like it arrived not a moment too soon. Besides, "you can't go, all the plants are gonna die!" www.youtube.com/watch?v=GbVaisNPgh4 |
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Post by Bevo on Aug 30, 2017 17:33:42 GMT
The 4am advisory has the storm tracking to Cameron LA. My back yard...almost As I look at the radar just now, the exact CENTER of Harvey is literally, RIGHT OVER you back yard! |
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Post by Bevo on Aug 31, 2017 2:37:15 GMT
Maybe, the story that will define this storm came this morning:
An 18-month old child rescued, just moments before she was washed away under a bridge. This child survived, somehow, clinging to the floating body of her drowned mother. I don't even know how that can happen. I have to believe, this mother's spirit was not willing to leave this child alone. Not until, she was safe.
Harvey has been a NIGHTMARE storm in an area so wide, it would take 5 hours to drive across it, at 70 mph, with no traffic. It's a HUGE area. In the next few days, we're going to be hearing more and more about the damage that has been done. It's unfathomable.
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Post by Bevo on Aug 31, 2017 3:07:00 GMT
My prayer is this: That the TEXAS response to this storm will show the country how much Texas people care about each other. No one in Houston is asking "who did you vote for" before they rescue someone. When life is threatened, we DO WHAT WE NEED TO DO to HELP EACH OTHER. Screw Washington. Screw Democrats AND Republicans. PEOPLE are helping PEOPLE. In Texas, it really doesn't matter if you're black, white, brown, red, or other. It's the least racist place I ever lived.
I love Texas.
Now, Texas will feel the love of the rest of the country. Love, that Texas would (and will) reciprocate in a heartbeat.
I love this country.
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Post by tigercpa on Aug 31, 2017 10:58:03 GMT
2 explosions at the Arkema Checmical Plat in Texas early this morning.
CEO said there was no way to prevent it, given the damage and current conditions.
Based on the threat assessment, officials had already declared a 1.5 mile evacuation zone around the area.
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