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Post by Bevo on Oct 3, 2018 16:00:22 GMT
That's why college football is so special, and so beloved....
In the last week of September, Penn State and Ohio State were playing for ALL the marbles. Win (Survive) and move on. Lose, and you're pretty much toast. What other sport can make that claim?
Losses in the regular season sure as hell don't matter in college basketball.
EVERY OTHER sport tosses the regular season in the toilet at the end. It's nothing more than a seeding mechanism for "The Tournament"... the ONLY thing that matters.
In college football, at the highest level, how you play DURING the season matters. Not even just wins and losses, but.. HOW you win.
It's just... different. And, I love it. Hook 'Em
PS> It's 11:59 am and, OU STILL sucks! |
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Post by EvilVodka on Oct 3, 2018 18:57:07 GMT
Time to play devil's advocate... Not all games matter. In fact, most conferences aren't even part of the playoff picture. It's quite possible at least two P5 conferences could even be on the outside looking in (Big XII and PAC 12).
The way the playoff is decided is worse than the BCS rankings ever were. As soon as the regular season ends, the complete sport shuts down while several people shut themselves into a room and decide who will be in the playoff....It is in fact the most retarded way to crown a championship outside of boxing and wrestling. A college football fan listens to the the music, autumn, rivalries, white-outs, tailgating, and then in December the record skips, and ta da, there are our postseason matchups. If college football wants the season to matter, get rid of the joke that is the committee. Have solid rankings. Make the college football conference championships matter (or don't and get rid of them!). College football is really close to having one of the best sports, but it can't seem to connect the amazing regular season to the postseason. |
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Post by bluehen on Oct 3, 2018 20:25:16 GMT
Good to see that not everyone around here is fooled by ESPN and the Cartel that runs the FBS post season with its 'regular season is a playoff' crap.
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Post by Bevo on Oct 3, 2018 22:10:42 GMT
Time to play devil's advocate... Not all games matter. In fact, most conferences aren't even part of the playoff picture. It's quite possible at least two P5 conferences could even be on the outside looking in (Big XII and PAC 12).
The way the playoff is decided is worse than the BCS rankings ever were. As soon as the regular season ends, the complete sport shuts down while several people shut themselves into a room and decide who will be in the playoff....It is in fact the most retarded way to crown a championship outside of boxing and wrestling. A college football fan listens to the the music, autumn, rivalries, white-outs, tailgating, and then in December the record skips, and ta da, there are our postseason matchups. If college football wants the season to matter, get rid of the joke that is the committee. Have solid rankings. Make the college football conference championships matter (or don't and get rid of them!). College football is really close to having one of the best sports, but it can't seem to connect the amazing regular season to the postseason. Not true to say " most conferences aren't a part of the playoff picture"... I think it is fair to say " Half of the conferences aren't part of the playoff picture". But, that's just because the NCAA is too stupid to officially recognize the very clear divide in competition levels between the P5 and G5. They should have separate playoff structures. The game could be better. My suggestions would be: 1) Have separate playoff systems for the G5 and P5 conferences... Give the highest seeded team in the G5 the option of which tourney they want to play in. 2) FORCE all FBS teams to play an equal number of games, and equal number for P5 and G5 teams... NO FCS teams. Ie: Standardize the level of competition 3) Choose 8 teams for the playoff: P5 Conference Champs, the Next 2 teams in a ranking like CJ's... totally objective, plus the highest ranked G5 team (IF, they choose to play in the top tier... a third P5 team if they choose not to) That would be awesome. But, it would require some NUTS on the NCAA Executive Committee. Even so... as things are, the play on the field, ALL YEAR LONG, determines who have a chance to compete. It's a unique, special, and exciting system. I love it! |
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Post by Hero on Oct 4, 2018 0:46:58 GMT
Time to play devil's advocate... Not all games matter. In fact, most conferences aren't even part of the playoff picture. It's quite possible at least two P5 conferences could even be on the outside looking in (Big XII and PAC 12).
The way the playoff is decided is worse than the BCS rankings ever were. As soon as the regular season ends, the complete sport shuts down while several people shut themselves into a room and decide who will be in the playoff....It is in fact the most retarded way to crown a championship outside of boxing and wrestling. A college football fan listens to the the music, autumn, rivalries, white-outs, tailgating, and then in December the record skips, and ta da, there are our postseason matchups. If college football wants the season to matter, get rid of the joke that is the committee. Have solid rankings. Make the college football conference championships matter (or don't and get rid of them!). College football is really close to having one of the best sports, but it can't seem to connect the amazing regular season to the postseason. Not true to say " most conferences aren't a part of the playoff picture"... I think it is fair to say " Half of the conferences aren't part of the playoff picture". But, that's just because the NCAA is too stupid to officially recognize the very clear divide in competition levels between the P5 and G5. They should have separate playoff structures. The game could be better. My suggestions would be: 1) Have separate playoff systems for the G5 and P5 conferences... Give the highest seeded team in the G5 the option of which tourney they want to play in. 2) FORCE all FBS teams to play an equal number of games, and equal number for P5 and G5 teams... NO FCS teams. Ie: Standardize the level of competition 3) Choose 8 teams for the playoff: P5 Conference Champs, the Next 2 teams in a ranking like CJ's... totally objective, plus the highest ranked G5 team (IF, they choose to play in the top tier... a third P5 team if they choose not to) That would be awesome. But, it would require some NUTS on the NCAA Executive Committee. Even so... as things are, the play on the field, ALL YEAR LONG, determines who have a chance to compete. It's a unique, special, and exciting system. I love it! 4) Limit the P5 group to 80 teams max. 5) P5 members would schedule all games against P5 Teams. 6) No Conference Championship Games. |
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Post by bluehen on Oct 4, 2018 11:53:32 GMT
Maybe there wouldn't be such a "divide" if the greedy cartel didn't insist on making up these self serving P5 and G5 monikers. Maybe if all NCAA CF was played within the context of the true NCAA divisions....
DI -FBS
D1 -FCS
DII
DIII
....maybe the schools relegated to the Cartel's made up "G5" phony division could recruit better...maybe with better recruited talent there would be more winning success...maybe with that success there would be a bigger FB budget and better facilities. Maybe if there was a national championship for ALL of the FBS. Maybe, just maybre etc etc etc. As long as the made up G5 division prevents those teams from fair post season opportunities there isn't any hope of closing the 'divide '. The Cartel's goal is to expand the divide and prevent equal opportunities so to hoard the money and glory.
There is absolutely no NCAA P5 or G5 divisions. Making those things up for the sake of greed is immoral, IMO. Shame on the cartel ( which includes ESPN )
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Post by Bevo on Oct 4, 2018 17:52:55 GMT
There is absolutely no NCAA P5 or G5 divisions. Making those things up for the sake of greed is immoral, IMO. Shame on the cartel ( which includes ESPN ) The difference isn't "made up" by any cartel. It's just the reality of the situation.
It's the product of some schools growing and some schools not. It's not static either. Schools, and conferences... over time, could move in EITHER direction.
But, for now.. it's a VERY plain, and VERY SHARP distinction between them. I really don't understand the desire to ignore this reality, or the resistance to allowing them to each participate in a fair, resource based grouping that allows them to compete for their own Post-season accolades.
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Post by stumpystew on Oct 4, 2018 20:42:11 GMT
I have to disagree. There are some schools and programs, in the Mountain West and American Athletic, that have as nice, or maybe better, facilities and things that some of the schools and programs in the P5 conferences do. And as for every game mattering, we saw in the last 2 years that is not true. 2 schools made it to the "playoffs" with out even playing in their conference championship game. This is why the Big 12 went to one, to not get screwed for not having one.
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Post by bluehen on Oct 4, 2018 23:39:01 GMT
Only the games that the cartel wants to matter matter...common knowledge. 'All games matter' (FBS) is one of sports biggest myths ( but ESPN continues to fool the masses ) Hey Stumpy, I may have asked this before but do you miss the days when the Apps were competing for NCAA D1 national titles rather than low level Post Season Exhibition game trophies  ? |
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Post by Bevo on Oct 5, 2018 1:50:54 GMT
I have to disagree. There are some schools and programs, in the Mountain West and American Athletic, that have as nice, or maybe better, facilities and things that some of the schools and programs in the P5 conferences do. And as for every game mattering, we saw in the last 2 years that is not true. 2 schools made it to the "playoffs" with out even playing in their conference championship game. This is why the Big 12 went to one, to not get screwed for not having one. They might have nice facilities.. they may even have larger student bodies... but, the ATHLETIC BUDGETS are not the same. Not even close. The P5 get so much money from their conference split of TV money, they have significantly more money to spend than the G5 schools. The line is sharp... Very few G5 schools have budgets higher than the LOWEST P5 school budget. A few years ago, there was ZERO overlap. More recently, I've seen 1-3 schools that overlap. The division is pretty clear. It's not really something that is debatable. It's just fact. |
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Post by Bevo on Oct 5, 2018 1:52:52 GMT
As for every game mattering, those teams that made the CFP without winning their CCG made it because, they WON a WHOLE bunch of games, against good competition, during the year. They only had ONE loss. Mostly, they got chosen over teams with 2 losses.
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Post by tigercpa on Oct 5, 2018 9:49:07 GMT
I have to disagree. There are some schools and programs, in the Mountain West and American Athletic, that have as nice, or maybe better, facilities and things that some of the schools and programs in the P5 conferences do. And as for every game mattering, we saw in the last 2 years that is not true. 2 schools made it to the "playoffs" with out even playing in their conference championship game. This is why the Big 12 went to one, to not get screwed for not having one. They might have nice facilities.. they may even have larger student bodies... but, the ATHLETIC BUDGETS are not the same. Not even close. The P5 get so much money from their conference split of TV money, they have significantly more money to spend than the G5 schools. The line is sharp... Very few G5 schools have budgets higher than the LOWEST P5 school budget. A few years ago, there was ZERO overlap. More recently, I've seen 1-3 schools that overlap. The division is pretty clear. It's not really something that is debatable. It's just fact. Agreed, it's not debatable.
I would go further and say that my opinion is that if you combine all of FBS into a single "entity" and host an all-inclusive playoff, you would only exacerbate the current divide. You might even cause a few schools to drop their programs all together.
P5 beats G5 how often? About 84% of the time in recent years. It's not even close.
Which gap do you think is smaller?
FCS to G5? G5 to P5?
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Post by bluehen on Oct 5, 2018 12:07:30 GMT
I respectfully disagree, CPA.
Equal opportunity = propensity for fairness and parity.....a chance to grow and flourish.
Complete forbidding of equal opportunity = permanent divide
...in , so called, college football, other sports and real life.
Are you elitists against the concept of equal opportunity in American society and culture too ?
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Post by Bevo on Oct 5, 2018 12:38:14 GMT
Complete forbidding of equal opportunity = permanent divide Your point is very sound, except for one problem: There currently is NO 'complete forbidding'. Nor would there be if the P5 and G5 officially separated their post-season play.
As it is now, schools that are growing and excelling (like UCF) can rise from the G5 ranks and get into a P5 conference. With the right breaks, they could even break into the CFP. But, before you offer me a 10-1 bet, yes...I admit, it would be VERY difficult. The deck is definitely stacked against them, and against any G5 team. But, not unfairly. It's a built in scheduling disadvantage.
UCF won't crack the ceiling this year... even if they run their record to 25-0. Because they were unable to play a critical game against NC St. But, what if... they go undefeated this year, win another impressive bowl game, and then run the table again next year with a couple of OOC wins against decent P5 opponents?
Do you really think the CFP Committee would ignore a team at 37-0? I don't. I think the public outcry would sway them. If only to protect their precious "integrity".
If there were a separate post-season (and, I DON'T Support P5 not playing against G5 teams at all in the regular season)... I could definitely see teams moving back and forth between the conferences. Re-alignment would continue, where it makes sense. I could even seen an entire conference shifting... If the Big 12 doesn't get it's shit together, they may be first. All it would take would be, an up tick in the AAC, and then... have Texas and OU jump from the B12 to the AAC. Think that couldn't happen?
If we've learned anything about college football in the past 20 years it's: Expect the unexpected. 100 year relationships dissolve overnight when some conference waives a couple of million dollars around.
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Post by bluehen on Oct 5, 2018 14:15:04 GMT
Yes, Bevo, I do really think the Cartel and its DPI ( Dr. Pepper Invitational ) event would continue to exclude a 37-0 UCF simply because of the AAC conference patch on its jerseys. With the 'correct' conference jersey patch 11-2 can get a team an invite to this TV driven event....but 37-0 will not with the wrong patch plus having a school with a 'directional ' name to it is not a great TV draw. FBS need an NCAA style national championship.....the "national" referring to 'nation' That would be a national championship for all the entire nation...for all the FBS. This stigmatizing G5/P5 crap eliminates half the CF nation from opportunities to compete. Of course, as usual, I hope I'm 100% dead wrong about all of this.
Regarding your suggestion for separate mythical national championships for the privileged , so called, 'P5s and the stigmatized, so called 'G5s' I believe there are enough NCAA competition divisions/subdivisions to cover levels of CF.
We already have :
NCAA Div III with a true , all inclusive, on field, competition based, 'national' championship
NCAA Div II with a true, all inclusive, on field, competition based, 'national' championship
NCAA div I (FCS subdivision) with a true, all inclusive, on field, competition based 'national' championship....all administered and awarded by the governing body of the sport
and, unfortunately...
NCAA div 1 (FBS subdivision) without a true, all inclusive, on field, competition based 'national' championship....but rather an opinion based , very exclusive, conference room concocted, voted invitational bowl event for only half of the FBS. ...not administered by the governing body of the sport but by big TV and its bowl industry.
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