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Post by tigercpa on Nov 3, 2017 17:13:29 GMT
Oh c'mon CPA. When you say CFB does it this way ( the DPI system) that is incorrect. You should be saying that the 'P5' club does it this way only. The P5 club represents only 8% of all college football programs. That's right, 92 % of college football is more sports mainstream in that it determines champions with actual championship playoffs. The 8% comes from this : There are 774 colleges and universities that sponsor CF programs including the 65, so called, 'P5' programs. These 774 CF teams are spread among 89 total conferences and 5 official divisions. NCAA Division III has 262 teams and its championship semifinalists are determined by an all inclusive , on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division II has 169 teams and its championship semifinalists are determined by an all inclusive, on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division I - Football Championship Subdivision has 124 teams and its semifinalists are determined by an inclusive, on field, elimination playoff NAIA Football has 89 teams and its semifinalists are determined by an inclusive , on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division I - Football Bowl Subdivision has 130 teams and its semi-finalists are limited to 65 teams determined by a board room beauty contest style vote. So when arguing on behalf of a mythical championship system keep em separate, please..the 8% that subjectively' votes' and the 92 % that actually 'plays' regarding their championship ideology. In the P5, the regular season serves as a "playoff"...
I almost prefer that over say the NCAA basketball Tourney, where if the at-large, 42nd seed gets hot and wins...somehow they are the "best" team??
If they were the best team, why didn't they play like it during the season?
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Post by GatorGrad on Nov 3, 2017 18:08:16 GMT
Back to the question of whether the pop polls have any influence on the DPI committee voters. Now GG, do you think there might be any mention at all of 'ranked' when these folks are sitting around the table making cases for various teams....like this or that team "lost only to a 'ranked' team", beat x # of 'ranked' teams, played x# of 'ranked' teams etc..or are you 100% certain that the word 'ranked' is NEVER spoken in these meetings. If it is spoken at all then there is an influence and the championship is still mythically (opinion) driven. If they do, it would be in reference to their own CFP rankings...not the Coaches Poll which nobody cares about anymore.
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Post by FLORIDA HERD FAN on Nov 3, 2017 18:12:14 GMT
Oh c'mon CPA. When you say CFB does it this way ( the DPI system) that is incorrect. You should be saying that the 'P5' club does it this way only. The P5 club represents only 8% of all college football programs. That's right, 92 % of college football is more sports mainstream in that it determines champions with actual championship playoffs. The 8% comes from this : There are 774 colleges and universities that sponsor CF programs including the 65, so called, 'P5' programs. These 774 CF teams are spread among 89 total conferences and 5 official divisions. NCAA Division III has 262 teams and its championship semifinalists are determined by an all inclusive , on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division II has 169 teams and its championship semifinalists are determined by an all inclusive, on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division I - Football Championship Subdivision has 124 teams and its semifinalists are determined by an inclusive, on field, elimination playoff NAIA Football has 89 teams and its semifinalists are determined by an inclusive , on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division I - Football Bowl Subdivision has 130 teams and its semi-finalists are limited to 65 teams determined by a board room beauty contest style vote. So when arguing on behalf of a mythical championship system keep em separate, please..the 8% that subjectively' votes' and the 92 % that actually 'plays' regarding their championship ideology. In the P5, the regular season serves as a "playoff"...
I almost prefer that over say the NCAA basketball Tourney, where if the at-large, 42nd seed gets hot and wins...somehow they are the "best" team??
If they were the best team, why didn't they play like it during the season?
A good question for which answer is simple and obvious. But first, the P5 regular season no more serves as a playoff than do the G5, FBS, FCS, DII and DIII regular seasons. The answer to your question explains why Jim Valvano’s NC State team was the legitimate national champion. The conflict lies with the distinction between “best season” and “best team”. Teams evolve as the season progresses, with some improving and some declining. A championship playoff determines the best team at the moment, which might be very different than the best team over the course of the season. To your point, if the 42nd seed suddenly gets hot and wins, then, by definition, it is the best team at the moment. The national champion, via an inclusive playoff system, is the best team at the moment.
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Post by tigercpa on Nov 3, 2017 18:52:54 GMT
In the P5, the regular season serves as a "playoff"...
I almost prefer that over say the NCAA basketball Tourney, where if the at-large, 42nd seed gets hot and wins...somehow they are the "best" team??
If they were the best team, why didn't they play like it during the season?
A good question for which answer is simple and obvious. But first, the P5 regular season no more serves as a playoff than do the G5, FBS, FCS, DII and DIII regular seasons. The answer to your question explains why Jim Valvano’s NC State team was the legitimate national champion. The conflict lies with the distinction between “best season” and “best team”. Teams evolve as the season progresses, with some improving and some declining. A championship playoff determines the best team at the moment, which might be very different than the best team over the course of the season. To your point, if the 42nd seed suddenly gets hot and wins, then, by definition, it is the best team at the moment. The national champion, via an inclusive playoff system, is the best team at the moment. I would say the regular does serve as a playoff, while not a strict single-elimination process, it does serve to eliminate teams from playoff contention.
I would also say that the winner of the NCAA Tournament is, correctly, the NCAA Tournament Champion, but also a "mythical" national champion. The winner is the NCAA Division I Men's Basketball Tournament Champion.. Nothing more. We have assigned it the nomenclature of "national champion."
We have to call Alabama the Dr. Pepper Pretend Mythical Exclusive Champion, let's call them all correctly.
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Post by tigercpa on Nov 3, 2017 18:57:09 GMT
Oh c'mon CPA. When you say CFB does it this way ( the DPI system) that is incorrect. You should be saying that the 'P5' club does it this way only. The P5 club represents only 8% of all college football programs. That's right, 92 % of college football is more sports mainstream in that it determines champions with actual championship playoffs. The 8% comes from this : There are 774 colleges and universities that sponsor CF programs including the 65, so called, 'P5' programs. These 774 CF teams are spread among 89 total conferences and 5 official divisions. NCAA Division III has 262 teams and its championship semifinalists are determined by an all inclusive , on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division II has 169 teams and its championship semifinalists are determined by an all inclusive, on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division I - Football Championship Subdivision has 124 teams and its semifinalists are determined by an inclusive, on field, elimination playoff NAIA Football has 89 teams and its semifinalists are determined by an inclusive , on field, elimination playoff NCAA Division I - Football Bowl Subdivision has 130 teams and its semi-finalists are limited to 65 teams determined by a board room beauty contest style vote. So when arguing on behalf of a mythical championship system keep em separate, please..the 8% that subjectively' votes' and the 92 % that actually 'plays' regarding their championship ideology. That's what I'm referring to, P5 or FCS, or the championship division, or the Larry Culpepper, Dr.Pepper Division or whatever.
The bottom line is, I enjoy it. Would I prefer a somewhat expanded playoff? Sure.
Am I not going to watch because it doesn't fit in a certain sized box, or fit a certain ideology? Nope.
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Post by bluehen on Nov 3, 2017 19:38:11 GMT
" The Larry Culpepper, DPI Invitational " ?..Hey, I like that, CPA I enjoy the heck out of the CFP too. I give up a monster fiddlin party on New Year's Eve to watch the voted semi-finals. Some music friends don't think much of that.. Anyway glad you see that only 8 % of college football actually uses this strange CFP ideology. And the regular seasons of the competition based championship divisions of CF ( the other 92%) might actually be more meaningful since the factual 'standings' of all the leagues provide automatic qualifiers. Always remember conference standings and titles are not opinionated or voted. That's all we have left in FBS that isn't opinionated/voted.
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Post by bluehen on Nov 3, 2017 19:44:08 GMT
Back to the question of whether the pop polls have any influence on the DPI committee voters. Now GG, do you think there might be any mention at all of 'ranked' when these folks are sitting around the table making cases for various teams....like this or that team "lost only to a 'ranked' team", beat x # of 'ranked' teams, played x# of 'ranked' teams etc..or are you 100% certain that the word 'ranked' is NEVER spoken in these meetings. If it is spoken at all then there is an influence and the championship is still mythically (opinion) driven. If they do, it would be in reference to their own CFP rankings...not the Coaches Poll which nobody cares about anymore. There were no CFP rankings to mention for this first edition vote.....so you're 100% certain that the word 'ranked' never was spoken when evaluating teams and resumes ? The conference room needs to be 'bugged' to really find out. I think 'ranked' was likely spoken and referred to, but certainly can't prove it.
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Post by FLORIDA HERD FAN on Nov 4, 2017 1:45:49 GMT
A good question for which answer is simple and obvious. But first, the P5 regular season no more serves as a playoff than do the G5, FBS, FCS, DII and DIII regular seasons. The answer to your question explains why Jim Valvano’s NC State team was the legitimate national champion. The conflict lies with the distinction between “best season” and “best team”. Teams evolve as the season progresses, with some improving and some declining. A championship playoff determines the best team at the moment, which might be very different than the best team over the course of the season. To your point, if the 42nd seed suddenly gets hot and wins, then, by definition, it is the best team at the moment. The national champion, via an inclusive playoff system, is the best team at the moment. I would say the regular does serve as a playoff, while not a strict single-elimination process, it does serve to eliminate teams from playoff contention.
I would also say that the winner of the NCAA Tournament is, correctly, the NCAA Tournament Champion, but also a "mythical" national champion. The winner is the NCAA Division I Men's Basketball Tournament Champion.. Nothing more. We have assigned it the nomenclature of "national champion."
We have to call Alabama the Dr. Pepper Pretend Mythical Exclusive Champion, let's call them all correctly.
1. The P5 regular season is no different than the regular seasons of G5 conferences, FBS, FCS, DII and DIII regular seasons. 2. All NCAA championships are real national championships because every NCAA national championship is sanctioned by the NCAA. Every NCAA championship trophy says, “NCAA National Champion”. 3. The CFP is not sanctioned by the NCAA. Thus, there is no, and can be no sanctioning body. The winner of the FCS playoff is the NCAA football champion for all of DI. Look at the trophy.
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Post by GatorGrad on Nov 5, 2017 18:32:56 GMT
If they do, it would be in reference to their own CFP rankings...not the Coaches Poll which nobody cares about anymore. There were no CFP rankings to mention for this first edition vote.....so you're 100% certain that the word 'ranked' never was spoken when evaluating teams and resumes ? The conference room needs to be 'bugged' to really find out. I think 'ranked' was likely spoken and referred to, but certainly can't prove it. Yes, I am 100% certain. You might as well take my word for it.
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Post by bluehen on Nov 6, 2017 15:11:02 GMT
There were no CFP rankings to mention for this first edition vote.....so you're 100% certain that the word 'ranked' never was spoken when evaluating teams and resumes ? The conference room needs to be 'bugged' to really find out. I think 'ranked' was likely spoken and referred to, but certainly can't prove it. Yes, I am 100% certain. You might as well take my word for it. Hope you're right
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Post by GatorGrad on Nov 10, 2017 15:17:15 GMT
Yes, I am 100% certain. You might as well take my word for it. Hope you're right I am...fret not.
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Post by tigercpa on Nov 10, 2017 17:09:58 GMT
In the P5, the regular season serves as a "playoff"...
I almost prefer that over say the NCAA basketball Tourney, where if the at-large, 42nd seed gets hot and wins...somehow they are the "best" team??
If they were the best team, why didn't they play like it during the season?
A good question for which answer is simple and obvious. But first, the P5 regular season no more serves as a playoff than do the G5, FBS, FCS, DII and DIII regular seasons. The answer to your question explains why Jim Valvano’s NC State team was the legitimate national champion. The conflict lies with the distinction between “best season” and “best team”. Teams evolve as the season progresses, with some improving and some declining. A championship playoff determines the best team at the moment, which might be very different than the best team over the course of the season. To your point, if the 42nd seed suddenly gets hot and wins, then, by definition, it is the best team at the moment. The national champion, via an inclusive playoff system, is the best team at the moment. Yeah, and I don;t like it. You go 18-14 in the regular season, win your conference on a fluke, or be AL, get hot and win 6 games out of 40 at the right time and somehow you are the best? Granted you are the tourney champion, but the best? Not sure....
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