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Post by tigercpa on Jun 1, 2018 17:05:35 GMT
Ok, cpa. 1) the NRA is most definitely the "boogeyman" in our nation's gun violence problems ( which doesn't exist..I know). Its warped, self serving interpretation of the 2A fools the great masses of less educated, less cerebral and gullible ( Trump 'base' types ) and puts false fear into their hearts with all the "they're gonna take your guns, they'll take your guns for sure !!!!!.beware !" bullshit. And playing that propaganda based fear the NRA is successful at steering that category of voter into supporting 'gun' candidates and defeating politicians with a conscience that would have the fortitude to do something about the problem ( that doesn't exist ) 2) Compare the ballistic numbers of .22 and .223 caliber rounds- no comparison in deadly capability. Heck, just look at the powder/bullet relationship of each. The BH plan """""""""" Total focus on ammo regulation !!!. It's not feasible to retrieve all the deadly weaponry from all the dangerous lunatics running around with that stuff. I would totally federalize ammo management. No more states deciding anything gun/ammo related. Greatly empower the ATF bureau and establish regional ATF armories that would be the only place available for citizens to purchase firearms ammunition....no more on line purchases, mail order ammo, or retail buying at the corner store, Wal-Mart, Bass Pro...no place but ATF facilities ! Furthermore, to purchase ammo from the ATF one must be issued a license. To obtain an ammo license a citizen ((legal US citizen) MUST be 21 , must have a minimum tested IQ of 100, must have, at least, a HS diploma, must pay taxes ( unless legitimately disabled), must have a total felony free crime record and no more than two misdemeanor convictions, and must not have any previous mental health issues.... all similar to what I think voter eligibility should be. Ammo license applicants will be THOROUGHLY vetted by the ATF bureau....no cracks ! Manufacturing, smuggling selling or obtaining ammo in any other manner will be a federal felony offense and punishable by prison sentences. Also, ammo quantities will be limited to an annual quota for licensed ammo buyers. The only actual federal 'gun' regulation would be a total ban on the marketing of large magazine capacity , semi auto, rifles and handguns. Haven't decided on the max # of rounds yet. There you go, cpa. The BH plan would not prevent intelligent, responsible, mentally stable, law abiding citizens from hunting, collecting, target shooting or home defending but in time it would make a big difference in the US's planet leading firearm violence problem ( which doesn't exist ). So, are you ready to quit the NRA now   Remind me again what NRA's warped, self serving interpretation of 2A is please.
Also, you realize that by including paying taxes, a HS diploma and an IQ requirement, you will be called a huge racist and white supremacist. The left wingers would go bonkers over these restrictions being included, for guns or voting.
Licensing---->Registration---->Database---->Confiscation. That is the ultimate goal. That's why lawmakers made the creation of a gun-owner registry illegal. They knew it could easily be abused.
Congressmen routinely propose this, and people say "no one is proposing to take away your guns"....except they are!
You are literally trying to burden 90 million law abiding gun owners over 1,700 deaths a year. A truly non-existent "crisis". I know you mentioned that some of those law-abiding citizens become shooters, and you think the same thing won't happen with ammo, which is smaller and more fungible?
Who is anyone else to tell me how many rounds "you think I need". Why do you, or anyone else get to determine that for me? What kind of firearm I buy, what caliber it shoots, etc.
Not ready to quit the NRA, it's one of the few organizations that actually stands up for constitutional rights of citizens. Many members of the NRA join just for this very purpose. It's truly a grass-roots organization. Not the evil boogeyman you think it is.
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 1, 2018 21:57:14 GMT
Ok, cpa. 1) the NRA is most definitely the "boogeyman" in our nation's gun violence problems ( which doesn't exist..I know). Its warped, self serving interpretation of the 2A fools the great masses of less educated, less cerebral and gullible ( Trump 'base' types ) and puts false fear into their hearts with all the "they're gonna take your guns, they'll take your guns for sure !!!!!.beware !" bullshit. And playing that propaganda based fear the NRA is successful at steering that category of voter into supporting 'gun' candidates and defeating politicians with a conscience that would have the fortitude to do something about the problem ( that doesn't exist ) 2) Compare the ballistic numbers of .22 and .223 caliber rounds- no comparison in deadly capability. Heck, just look at the powder/bullet relationship of each. The BH plan """""""""" Total focus on ammo regulation !!!. It's not feasible to retrieve all the deadly weaponry from all the dangerous lunatics running around with that stuff. I would totally federalize ammo management. No more states deciding anything gun/ammo related. Greatly empower the ATF bureau and establish regional ATF armories that would be the only place available for citizens to purchase firearms ammunition....no more on line purchases, mail order ammo, or retail buying at the corner store, Wal-Mart, Bass Pro...no place but ATF facilities ! Furthermore, to purchase ammo from the ATF one must be issued a license. To obtain an ammo license a citizen ((legal US citizen) MUST be 21 , must have a minimum tested IQ of 100, must have, at least, a HS diploma, must pay taxes ( unless legitimately disabled), must have a total felony free crime record and no more than two misdemeanor convictions, and must not have any previous mental health issues.... all similar to what I think voter eligibility should be. Ammo license applicants will be THOROUGHLY vetted by the ATF bureau....no cracks ! Manufacturing, smuggling selling or obtaining ammo in any other manner will be a federal felony offense and punishable by prison sentences. Also, ammo quantities will be limited to an annual quota for licensed ammo buyers. The only actual federal 'gun' regulation would be a total ban on the marketing of large magazine capacity , semi auto, rifles and handguns. Haven't decided on the max # of rounds yet. There you go, cpa. The BH plan would not prevent intelligent, responsible, mentally stable, law abiding citizens from hunting, collecting, target shooting or home defending but in time it would make a big difference in the US's planet leading firearm related violence. Quit the NRA, cpa and get on board with common sense !! If I die from a .22 wound or a .223 wound, do I really care that one was "more deadly"?
The problem is: we've tried ammo regulation before....multiple times. Even your beloved ATF said: "The Bureau and the [Treasury] Department have recognized that current recordkeeping requirements for ammunition have no substantial law enforcement value."
"Ammunition is a fundamentally different commodity than everything else we have discussed … It is fungible, consumable, reloadable, and cannot be marked in any practical way that would permit it to be tracked or traced. Any practical proposal for ammunition would need to consider the significant burdens associated with licensing, authorizations, and recordkeeping for ammunition that is produced and transferred in the billions of rounds per year."
This was 1986, after multiple attempts to regulate ammo. There is no value is doing so.
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Post by bluehen on Jun 3, 2018 12:50:36 GMT
After researching I'm glad you can see that a high powered, high velocity .223 round is not a 'glorified .22'. Check in any time, cpa. I'll try to help ya with firearms info.
With my plan ( zero retail availability of ammo -which has never been tried ) I believe ammo can, indeed, be successfully regulated. You're getting all you info and opinions from the NRA site, right ?
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Post by bluehen on Jun 3, 2018 12:59:05 GMT
" I could walk on the street and shoot somebody in the head and they'll still love me " ....as the crowds at Trumps rallies stand behind him with their caps wildly cheering !!!
" The greatest argument against a democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter " - Winston Churchill
I believe there is a connection here, Bevo.
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 3, 2018 15:08:07 GMT
After researching I'm glad you can see that a high powered, high velocity .223 round is not a 'glorified .22'. Check in any time, cpa. I'll try to help ya with firearms info. With my plan ( zero retail availability of ammo -which has never been tried ) I believe ammo can, indeed, be successfully regulated. You're getting all you info and opinions from the NRA site, right ? With either caliber - the right shot placement and you are dead and if you are dead, do you really care if one was high velocity or not? My guess is not. With 4 trillions rounds of ammo already in civilian hands, it’s doubtful a no- retail approach will have a measurable effect. Most likely it would result in a strong dark market for Ammo. That’s always the problem With “common sense” gun laws - the unintended consequences. The NRA - promoting gun safety, civil rights and responsible gun ownership since 1871. |
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Post by bluehen on Jun 3, 2018 22:52:40 GMT
No comparison, cpa in the deadliness and knockdown power of a .22 and a .223. If they were exactly the same why wouldn't the US DOD and NATO just use .22 rifles instead ? It would be much cheaper. Do you have an AR-15 style weapon ? I've got a .22LR. Bring it down for some target shooting & testing. You will see the massive difference.
It would certainly take some time for ammo regulation to take effect if ammo was ONLY available through ATF and ONLY available to heavily vetted license holders....but it would be a common sense start, imo.
That's the old NRA. The present one sells weaponry on behalf of the weaponry manufacturers.
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Post by Bevo on Jun 4, 2018 2:18:44 GMT
" I could walk on the street and shoot somebody in the head and they'll still love me " ....as the crowds at Trumps rallies stand behind him with their caps wildly cheering !!! " The greatest argument against a democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter " - Winston Churchill I believe there is a connection here, Bevo. Hen, you’ve fallen for a hoax. The connection is : NEITHER man actually said those quotes. |
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 4, 2018 9:44:33 GMT
No comparison, cpa in the deadliness and knockdown power of a .22 and a .223. If they were exactly the same why wouldn't the US DOD and NATO just use .22 rifles instead ? It would be much cheaper. Do you have an AR-15 style weapon ? I've got a .22LR. Bring it down for some target shooting & testing. You will see the massive difference. It would certainly take some time for ammo regulation to take effect if ammo was ONLY available through ATF and ONLY available to heavily vetted license holders....but it would be a common sense start, imo. That's the old NRA. The present one sells weaponry on behalf of the weaponry manufacturers. Yep, I have a .22, an AR-15, and an AR-10. I am aware of the differences, and so is my shoulder 😀 |
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 4, 2018 10:05:03 GMT
No comparison, cpa in the deadliness and knockdown power of a .22 and a .223. If they were exactly the same why wouldn't the US DOD and NATO just use .22 rifles instead ? It would be much cheaper. Do you have an AR-15 style weapon ? I've got a .22LR. Bring it down for some target shooting & testing. You will see the massive difference. It would certainly take some time for ammo regulation to take effect if ammo was ONLY available through ATF and ONLY available to heavily vetted license holders....but it would be a common sense start, imo. That's the old NRA. The present one sells weaponry on behalf of the weaponry manufacturers. The NRA doesn’t sell guns. when are we going to do something about these high capacity tools of death an$ better regulate who should be able to buy and operate them? I’m speaking here of these 300-700hp cars that are routinely produced. No one needs that much horsepower given our current driving laws. And the Speciality auto equipment marketing association that promotes all manner of auto parts designed to turn your Hyundai into a high-speed lethal killing machine. we have a car culture problem in this country. |
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 4, 2018 10:06:01 GMT
" I could walk on the street and shoot somebody in the head and they'll still love me " ....as the crowds at Trumps rallies stand behind him with their caps wildly cheering !!! " The greatest argument against a democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter " - Winston Churchill I believe there is a connection here, Bevo. Hen, you’ve fallen for a hoax. The connection is : NEITHER man actually said those quotes. Don’t feel bad, millions still believe Sarah Palin said she could see Russia from her porch. |
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Post by Hero on Jun 4, 2018 11:32:41 GMT
No comparison, cpa in the deadliness and knockdown power of a .22 and a .223. If they were exactly the same why wouldn't the US DOD and NATO just use .22 rifles instead ? It would be much cheaper. Do you have an AR-15 style weapon ? I've got a .22LR. Bring it down for some target shooting & testing. You will see the massive difference. It would certainly take some time for ammo regulation to take effect if ammo was ONLY available through ATF and ONLY available to heavily vetted license holders....but it would be a common sense start, imo. That's the old NRA. The present one sells weaponry on behalf of the weaponry manufacturers. The NRA doesn’t sell guns. when are we going to do something about these high capacity tools of death an$ better regulate who should be able to buy and operate them? I’m speaking here of these 300-700hp cars that are routinely produced. No one needs that much horsepower given our current driving laws. And the Speciality auto equipment marketing association that promotes all manner of auto parts designed to turn your Hyundai into a high-speed lethal killing machine. we have a car culture problem in this country. The AR 10 must be a monster to shoot. |
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 4, 2018 15:16:46 GMT
The NRA doesn’t sell guns. when are we going to do something about these high capacity tools of death an$ better regulate who should be able to buy and operate them? I’m speaking here of these 300-700hp cars that are routinely produced. No one needs that much horsepower given our current driving laws. And the Speciality auto equipment marketing association that promotes all manner of auto parts designed to turn your Hyundai into a high-speed lethal killing machine. we have a car culture problem in this country. The AR 10 must be a monster to shoot. It's got more kick than a .22 or an AR-15 for sure. Not as bad as a 12ga, tho IMO.
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 4, 2018 15:51:50 GMT
We have 33,000 deaths per year by gun. Nowhere near the top of the list in terms of various causes of death.
Of that roughly 67% are suicides. 21,000
Of that, 1 in 5 (20%) are drug/gang related gun deaths. One group of recidivists killing another group of recidivists.
That's 87% of the total, so far.
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Post by bluehen on Jun 5, 2018 11:06:11 GMT
The NRA absolutely and unequivocally 'sells' guns on behalf of weapon manufacturers. When you advertise these weapons in your publications and websites and review and promote them in your 'gun of the month' feature you're selling. Most of the NRA's revenue comes from weapon manufacturers in advertising fees and donations .
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Post by tigercpa on Jun 5, 2018 11:17:34 GMT
The NRA absolutely and unequivocally 'sells' guns on behalf of weapon manufacturers. When you advertise these weapons in your publications and websites and review and promote them in your 'gun of the month' feature you're selling. Most of the NRA's revenue comes from weapon manufacturers in advertising fees and donations . Who would have thought that a trade / industry organization would promote the products and services within the industry it represents?  |
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